Talk:Character secrets

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Charlie is a heroin addict... not really a secret is it? Locke knows, Jack knows, Claire knows, Sawyer knows...

My idea when creating this page was to catalogue all the tidbits of information that certain characters have (or had) to themselves that others don't know about. i.e. if Claire had known about Charlie's addiction sooner, would she have treated him differently? etc. Certain "secrets", like Kate being a fugitive, or Sun speaking English, may now be public knowledge to all the survivors, but nonetheless played a role in the development of the story, and thus I felt were worth capturing. --Joseph 17:07, 22 February 2006 (PST)

Contents

Organization: By Character? Chronologically?

I'm wondering if there is a better way to organize this page. Should we go alphabetically by character, or perhaps chronologically (in other words, by the order in which the secrets were first introduced to the audience)? Thoughts? Alternatives? --Joseph 17:10, 22 February 2006 (PST)

I'd say by character :-) The cleanest solution IMO --Jambalaya 17:56, 22 February 2006 (PST)

I agree, for what it's worth.--User:Tricksterson

Thanks guys, I will work on reorganizing in the next few days --«««Joseph»»» 08:07, 23 February 2006 (PST)

Revamped the article to cover characters and their secrets instead of a list separate character secrets, as it's IMO more organised this way. Someone else can arrange the characters alphabetically. :) --skks 03:58, 9 March 2006 (PST)

Talk: Kate is a fugitive

Uh. I thought that was her step father.

She thought it was her step-father, but it turned out to be her real father... Sam Austen turns out not to be her biological father. Also, does anyone remember how Hurley and Sawyer found out about Kate? Did anyone else know (besides Jack) that she was a fugitive, prior to Sawyer letting out the secret to everyone? -- «««Joseph»»» 17:02, 28 February 2006 (PST)

Yes, Hurley found Kate's fugitive photograph. "I think" he found out after Jack.
Also, Sawyer found out when he caught Kate forging her new passport. He let the secret slip later that episode, so Michael wouldn't take her on the raft. 73rd survivor 12:58, 15 May 2008 (PDT)

What about......

Jack, Kate, Locke, Hurley, and Arntz (RIP) all knowing about what happened to Roussoues crew mates and how they died? And now Clarie knows.

Or the whole Henry Gale secret? Locke, Jack, Mr. Ecko, Sayid, and Charlie (Gollum) only know about that.

or walt burning the raft ("...In Translation")--Connor401 19:03, 3 August 2007 (PDT)

Hurley's name

It's listed that one of Hurley's secrets, known only to Hurley, is his real name. Jack knows that Hurley is not his real name, but doesn't know what the real name is. So, when Michael saw the list of people he was supposed to bring to The Others, the name was listed as Hugo Reyes, and Michael said that he knew who everyone on the list was. How does Michael know that Hugo is Hurley? Is it not a secret anymore? --suzi 12:50, 13 June 2006 (PDT)

Hurley's name

I believe that in "Everybody Hates Hugo", when Locke is talking to Hurley and telling him that he needs to keep rationing the food, Locke refers to Hurley as Hugo. So, another person apparently knows Hurley's real name. --suzi 07:22, 25 June 2006 (PDT) 

Actually Locke referred to Hurley as Hugo in "Exodus" I believe.--Tricksterson 07:57, 26 June 2006 (PDT)

I thought he only made a secret about the name Hurley. People know his name is Hugo, but they call him Hurly because he uses that name (like James uses Sawyer).

New Sectionbox template

I'm planning to convert this page to the new Template:Sectionbox Secret template over the next day or two (as I have time). I'll probably also change the main headers from: "Character name" to "Season number", as to reduce the number of level-2 headers. Each secret will be ordered according to when it was first introduced to the audience.--Dagg 10:18, 9 January 2007 (PST)

Cool makes the page look much better! --lewisg 10:47, 9 January 2007 (PST)
Glad you like it! I'm done making my planned changes now. The TOC is really big, but I like the way it gives a summary of all the secrets. There is a large(r) image at the top (like Economics), because there is plenty of room.--Dagg 07:39, 11 January 2007 (PST)

Alignment

RE: Obi-Dan Kenob's message in the article history:

It doesn't matter to me if the images are aligned left/right/left/right, or just right/right/right. Go ahead and make them all right/right, and if someone doesn't like it, they can comment here.--Dagg 10:08, 12 January 2007 (PST)

Hm.. ok i do like both ways, although i prefer the left right version, just looks more user friendly in a way. But either way im happy :D --lewisg 10:39, 12 January 2007 (PST)

Character secrets page is broken?

Is it just me, or is the Character secrets page broken? I tried breaking it up into sub-pages, and including the sub-pages via {{/Season1}}{{/Season2}}, but that didn't seem to help. My browser just spins and eventually gives a blank page.--Dagg 08:13, 13 January 2007 (PST)

  • Same here. I tried to see what the problem was and seemed to partly fix it but then it went bad again. I suggest someone reverts the page using this link:

http://www.lostpedia.com/index.php?title=character_secrets&action=history

Sorry, but I don't feel comfortable doing it myself.--Mr.Leaf 08:29, 13 January 2007 (PST)

    • I changed the template inclusion to links, and now the page loads. I suspect the page takes too long to build, and the web server is kill the connection after 30 to 60 seconds or so. Some service providers will do that. This page used to work just fine, so I suspect the service provider changed their config recently. There are likely some other broken pages on the site that'll also need changed into smaller pages, etc.--Dagg 08:44, 13 January 2007 (PST)
  • Okay, makes sense, thanks for fixing my mistake to. --Mr.Leaf 08:45, 13 January 2007 (PST)

Who knows?

Under the "who knows?" section of each secret, who should be put there? Should it be everyone who has appeared on LOST that knows the secret, everyone on the islna dthat knows the secret, or some other way to make a limit, because on some secrets, there can be a whole list of people. Also, should dead people be listed too or not? *Mothven*

Jin is infertile- Everyone knows?

In The man behind the curtain, sawyer plays the tape that says that Sun's husband was infertile before he arived on the island. Assuming that Locke listened to the tape, Everyone knows.--Tylerr395 14:03, 17 May 2007 (PDT)

Wait, actually I don't think every body would know because Jin probably doesn't understand enough english to know figure this out.--Tylerr395 14:39, 9 July 2007 (PDT)

Actually if you remember Sun told Jin (in flashback mode) about him being infertile.

Desmond is having flashes-secret?

I think that Desmond's having flashes of the future could be considered a secret. So far, I only think that Desmond, Charlie, whatever dEsmond's friend's name is, I'm not sure about Hurley, Claire

The papers that Locke read about Sawyer

In this paper can be writing that Sawyer has a daughter. Then Locke know, isn't he? --Loquo 04:37, 22 May 2007 (PDT)

The origin of Desmonds boat is not even a secret

It's no secret because he does not hide its origin. There is no reason for him to hide who he got it from. The entry even states it: because he does not know of Libby's significance for Hurley. And even if he would know there would be no reason to keep his meeting with Libby a secret because it would have no consequence if anyone would know. - In that vain you could just as well make the fact a secret that Kate was married once and doesn't tell anyone. But it has no significance for the show and its characters at all, just like the origin of Desmonds boat. I'd really like to delete that entry. Agreed? - Roger 10:18, 13 June 2007 (PDT)

Dozens of the entries on the list are not "secrets" in the sense that people go out of their way to hide their truth. This article seems to be using "character secrets" rather loosely, to refer to anything significant (though "significant" might be a stretch at times, considering the entries for Hurley's real name being Hugo) that some of the characters know and others don't. If we removed that entry, we'd also have to remove:

  • Locke saw the white light - There's no evidence that Locke has tried to conceal this fact. He just hasn't bothered to tell everyone. Hundreds of things that have happened to parts of the group were never openly stated to everyone else; why don't we have entries for the many other things that were revealed only gradually to people, like the existence of the Hatch (not learned by anyone other than Boone and Locke until very late in season 1), the fact that polar bears are on the island (which some people didn't realize until after season 1), the existence of the PEARL Station, the appearance of the Monster, the identity of the Black Rock, the fact that "Henry Gale" was really an Other, etc.?
  • Hurley's real name - Hurley never claimed that "Hurley" wasn't a nickname. This isn't a secret anymore than the fact that Libby's real name is "Elizabeth" is a secret, or that Ben's real name is "Benjamin".
  • Hurley is a multi-millionaire - This is the opposite of a "secret", in the traditional sense. Rather than concealing this fact, Hurley has made numerous attempts to try and tell other characters that he's rich, but he's failed to convince anyone.
  • Locke saw hieroglyphics - Just because Locke hasn't happened to mention this doesn't mean he was keeping it a "secret" from everyone. He probably just didn't understand what he'd seen, so he wouldn't know how to describe it.
  • Locke saw the blast door map - Same as above, though there's a stronger case for this being a secret since he was reluctant to tell Mr. Eko about it. Also, the fact that Locke saw the blast door map clearly isn't the relevant secret; rather, the secret is that there was a map there at all (which is why Desmond and Kelvin and Radzinsky are listed as knowing the secret even though they never knew that Locke saw the map). Also, I think we should mention that Ben might have known about the map, since he is the one who caused it to be revealed through some unknown means.
  • Kate took a pregnancy test - Again, why is this a big secret? Kate just hasn't gone around blabbing about it.
  • Ana worked with Jack's father - Her name is "Ana-Lucia", and neither she nor Jack's father ever tried to keep this secret; they just didn't have any reason to tell anyone about it, since it didn't seem relevant.
  • Libby gave Desmond the sailboat - Same as above. There was no reason for either character to discuss this.
  • Jin understands English very well - I think the importance of this is being exaggerated. He clearly doesn't know English that well, as he's still regularly confused by common words and phrases. He just knows it a little better than Sun and Sayid thought at the time. A five-minute mystery at best.
  • Sun shot and killed Colleen - Is there any evidence that she tried to hide this fact from anyone? Again, it just sounds like it hasn't come up. There's no strong reason for Sun to hide (at least from the other Losties) that she killed an Other.

- Silence 17:25, 15 July 2007 (PDT)

Why do we list dead characters as knowing secrets? and other inaccuracies

It strikes me that it doesn't make a lot of sense to claim that dead characters are keeping secrets from living ones. We list Mr. Eko, Boone, Anthony Cooper, Ana-Lucia, Kelvin, Shannon, Radzinsky, and Charlie as knowing a variety of secrets, but obviously they won't be able to reveal those secrets, and won't play a future role in the spread of them. I think we should at the very least draw some distinction between dead and living secret-knowers; maybe mention the dead ones after the living ones, like by saying "Mr. Eko knew before his death"?

Also, this page contradicts itself. It claims that Sawyer both knows and doesn't know that Hurley's real name is Hugo. It assumes that Sawyer learned Hurley's real name when Ms. Klugh said it, but then it later says that Sawyer "didn't make the connection" when reading a note signed by Hugo. Sawyer probably had too much on his mind to be paying attention to what Hurley was called at the time; this points to the fact that we shouldn't overestimate how much people know. Just because someone was said in their presence doesn't necessarily mean that they heard or understood it.

The page has many other blatant inaccuracies. It incorrectly claims that Sayid knew that Ana-Lucia was a murderer; nothing whatsoever in the episode implies this, as Ana-Lucia lies about what happened. Even more blatantly false is the claim that "everyone except Jin" knows that Jin is infertile; this is clearly not true, as Sun told Jin that he was infertile in "The Whole Truth", before anyone else learned about it.

Also, I don't recall Kate ever learning that Sun is the one who killed Colleen; and I don't see why Christian Shephard is listed as knowing some secrets, but not as knowing that he worked with Ana-Lucia (though admittedly he didn't know her name or significance. Also, "Juliet is working for the Others" should be changed to "Juliet was working for the Others", since she betrayed them again. And lastly, how many people actually think that Ben was born on the island? I don't recall him telling that to anyone other than Locke. If anything, fewer people may know the fiction than the truth, so I'm not sure that that, specifically, is an important "secret". (I'd consider the fact that Ben was a member of the DHARMA Initiative to be a much more significant secret.) -Silence 17:25, 15 July 2007 (PDT)

Hugo

The fact that Hurley's real name is Hugo is NOT a secret, it's just something "not everybody knows." I mean, because not everybody in the world knows who the hell is John Locke is his existence a secret? --DL 19:24, 3 August 2007 (PDT)

Is this page only for secrets, or is it for all noteworthy unshared information?

If the former, then I've listed 11 so-called "secrets" listed on this page which no character has ever made any effort to conceal from anyone; all of these, and probably several others, will need to be removed. If the latter, then I recommend a page move to Unshared character information or Unshared knowledge or similar. Either way, the current system is incoherent and contradictory. -Silence 20:20, 3 August 2007 (PDT)

I have to agree. Some of these are not secrets, merely omissions between characters who really wouldn't know or care such as whether or not Kate took a pregnancy test years ago. I wouldn't deem that as a secret. Kate being a fugitive is a secret, yes, because a secret always tends to imply a bit of shady footwork to keep it from spilling out in the open. This article needs major clean-up. --Easter 19:01, 27 April 2008 (PDT)

Format

While this article is "pretty", it's bloody difficult to edit, especially as there aren't separate edit links for each entry. Would anyone object to changing this to normal wiki format? -- LOSTonthisdarnisland 19:39, 6 April 2008 (PDT)

I agree. It'll be much easier to read with episode crossrefs in the normal wiki template. It wouldn't be unwieldy as there just isn't so much of a bulleted list to create. And I think it should be organized by character, rather than the secret itself. I'd volunteer for the clean-up if no one else does.--Easter 19:01, 27 April 2008 (PDT)
Would anyone object to something like this? See below...--Easter 18:51, 12 May 2008 (PDT)

Season 1

Kate

Kate
Season 1
  • Kate is a fugitive on the run for murdering her father. ("What Kate Did")
    • Kate's fugitive status was revealed to the other survivors by Sawyer. ("Born to Run")
  • It was Kate’s idea to poison the drinking water to help Sun prevent Jin from leaving on the raft. ("Do No Harm")
    • Sun is still the only one that knows it was Kate’s idea blah blah blah

Freighties

There should probably some secrets from the freighties listed:

-"We're here to rescue you." ... "You're not our primary objective." ... We're not actually going to save any of you.

-Kevin Johnson is actually Michael.

-(it's not proven who-did-what yet, but later there should be a section about who owns the freighter, and who dug up the graves and staged the fake airplane.) 73rd survivor 13:03, 15 May 2008 (PDT)

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